Freethought Without Thought

      
Freethought holds that individuals should not accept ideas proposed as truth without recourse to knowledge and reason. Thus, freethinkers strive to build their opinions on the basis of facts, scientific inquiry, and logical principles, independent of any logical fallacies or the intellectually limiting effects of authority, confirmation bias, cognitive bias, conventional wisdom, popular culture, prejudice, sectarianism, tradition, urban legend, and all other dogmas. Regarding religion, freethinkers hold that there is insufficient evidence to support the existence of supernatural phenomena.
 
From: Pedro Timóteo <pedro.timoteo@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Blog submission
To: "Reap" <ourlord_darwin@yahoo.com>


Hello,

I've removed Reap's Truth from Planet Atheism. Your feud with PZ Myers, which all your recent blog posts seem to be about, are not acceptable content there, and I've had several user complaints already.I think it's best that your blog and the aggregator part ways.


  And so here is where this leaves us.... After all of the ghost hunters, demonologists, psychics, people who think they can talk to the dead through a radio, rival radio personalities, critics of the podcast, evangelist preachers, apologetics, catholics, christians, dummies like Michelle Bachman, creationists, frauds like Kevin Trudeau..... after all the disputes and misunderstandings there is one group of people who have managed to censor or limit my speech and/or the accessibility of my words more than any other. That group is The FTB bloggers who are calling for 'social justice' and those involved in A+. There is no question about it. Even if Adam Lee disputes whether he is trying to censor me, he is attempting to do so in some ways

    Here is another interesting  fact. Pharyngula is still being posted at Planet Atheism.  No one can argue that PZ Myers is an open minded advocate of atheism, skepticism or and other type of ism. Time after time PZ has engaged in personal attacks and libel. The proof is there for all to see. It can be found laying around his blog posts and in his comment section. He has spread disinformation on a regular basis about numerous  people and subjects and then limited any peer review of his claims. He was claiming creationists as his victims, now he doesn't seem to care who he lies about. The general attitude of his blog comment section is a reflection of the venomous babbling PZ does when someone disagrees with him. When confronted he takes a passive aggressive tone or gives extreme examples in order to excuse his behavior.
   The fact that Planet Atheism chooses to remove my blog really isn't the end of the world. I already have a couple of offers to have my blog hosted at other sites which will result in more traffic than I saw from Planet Atheism. So a big "thank you" to the people who complained is in order because otherwise I never would have found these new venues.
  One thing I would like to point out is how wonderful it is to have PZ Myers fighting on the side of skepticism, atheism, feminism, and social justice. We need people to help us get away from the lies and injustice of religion so we can replace it with the lies and injustices of PZ Myers. We needed someone who is so egotistical he would force his beliefs on an entire group of people and call for the condemnation of anyone who does not follow him. Imagine for a minute if PZ Myers had a leadership role in our government.What would the result be? I find the thought nothing less than terrifying. Does anyone think having such a person as a mouthpiece is maybe not in our own best interests? Now don't get me wrong, I am not calling for censoring PZ but it would be nice to see people speak out against what is clearly doing harm to others and his approach is unfair and harmful in some cases. Be critical of me if you wish but I'm not telling lies about anyone and I have made it clear my opinions are just that, my opinion. I always invite people to listen to the other side and form their own opinions. You don't see that from PZ Myers, he would rather tell you how it is, and let there be no question, that is final.  The definition of freethought isn't whatever Freethought Blogs agrees with. They can try and 'take back' words if they want to waste time and energy. You can't take back what never belonged to you or anyone else in the first place.

PZ Myers-Destined to Failure

Scene 1

enter PZ Myers:
"It's hard to think of something to say when faced with so much bullshit"

  That is how PZ opens in a conversation  with TheSkepticalHeretic, C0nc0rdance & TheTruePooka which can be found here.

Hello??? HELLO!!?? Has anyone seen Stephanie Zvan?! She needs to get on this right away! It's clear all PZ can do is say the word "bullshit" when people try to have a conversation with him. Stephanie, get on that right away and please tell us all the made up reasons why it's okay for PZ to do that kind of thing but not anyone else. You know the context, or the alignment of the planets being different, or it was a joke.....right? 

People are depending on you Stephanie. You are the best qualified to make up excuses and pretend like there are legit reasons for people like PZ doing the EXACT same thing you have been criticizing others for . No one else has your kind of experience at it. In fact the way you deny reality and act like you are royalty while barking orders at the peasants (readers) is legendary (in your own mind). The way you actually think no one sees through your rhetoric is laughable (in everyone else's mind). Keep that in mind when you can't be consistent Stephanie, people are laughing at you, especially when you get angry. No one is frightened and no one is really listening. The people in your comment section would agree with anything you say. Is that the kind of writer you want to be Stephanie? No amount of denial can change the facts, you are only fooling yourself. Latest example  When Damion Reinhardt talks about the word "renounce" he never claims a different definition than you use, he just says it reminds him of another instance he considers similar.

On a more serious note-  Be honest, do you have a wheel next to your desk that gets a spin whenever this kinda shit happens? Ok , maybe that's going too far. It's a dartboard then? 

   This performance by PZ is full of hypocrisy and lies that seem almost like they are tangible. In fact I  feel the need to wipe the crap PZ is spewing off me at times. At one point in the discussion PZ talks about shutting down dissent to a volume he can manage. Just as we see so often from people like Stephanie Zvan and Ophelia Benson, he makes comments about things and people that are untrue and then complains about the continuous repetitive comments from readers. He shows no ability to consider that he may be even a little responsible for creating the very problem he is complaining about, not to mention the reaction he gets from the other member of the conversation. I half expected red lights and sirens to go off followed by Greg Laden busting in with his arms flailing and yelling "DANGER PZ! DANGER!" (Greg doesn't get out much) 

   Even though PZ starts out the conversation so (dis)respectfully, the hosts of the show remain composed and voice their opinions on his opinion. Then PZ does something even more disrespectful, (the nerve!) he treats every single one of these guys as if they are idiots. PZ sits there staring into the camera and lies to every one of them. There can be no question about his deliberate deception, not by any reasonable coherent adult human."If someone disagrees with me, that doesn't get them banned" Well yes, sometimes it does PZ. I can say this from experience. I disagreed with PZ calling me a racist. When I didn't use an approved style of reply he simply banned me started giving me different labels and claimed my reaction to his lies was proof he was correct. PZ is too damn dumb to see how he started the entire conflict by claiming knowledge when he had none whatsoever.  

      What PZ describes as "yammering" by people who "have nothing to say" is often people with real points of disagreement, valid arguments against what PZ has said. Some are people who have been banned because they disagreed with the way PZ describes their character. PZ loves to add insult to injury I guess by basically sending the message that he knows them better than they know themselves. The  assumption is that he is always correct, just like believers who think they already know all the answers. Especially when it comes to social issues. Like I've mentioned before, anyone with basic common sense should be able to understand the complexity of social interaction. Maybe you won't understand the details but you can still realize it is complex. Unless you are PZ Myers and you think the things people type in chat rooms translate into real world actions on a consistent basis.

 
C0nc0rdance makes the point that people  are trying to be heard and PZ dismisses his point too. PZ denies anyone has a right to be heard on his blog except him. He uses this point to excuse his censorship of anyone who says anything he disagrees with. The way PZ rationalizes his censorship is by equating every 'troll' to creationists who claim the earth is 6000 years old. 

   It is kinda tough to even present all the things wrong with PZ's position in this video, I just don't have the time to cover it all. I would suggest you watch it yourself. While I appreciate the people who organized this conversation I really wish they would have done a better job pointing out the way PZ misrepresented his own actions.

 There is no doubt a certain number of you are going to read this and say to yourself --Big surprise, what did you expect from PZ Myers? Don't get me wrong this is exactly the kind of thing I expect of PZ. If it had gone down any differently, then I would have been surprised. More and more people are beginning to realize Pharyngula is a joke most of the time.  Just look at the comment section and the kind of crap that goes on there. It's a hub of egotistical idiocy. It's a bunch of morons who couldn't figure out how to use a stamp if you gave them directions, under the delusion they are intelligent and intimidating. Maybe one day they will come to realize what clowns they look like but I wouldn't count on it. PZ complains about his comment section getting all screwed up if he allows just any every person in the world to post on it. Well there are plenty of blogs out there with little moderation doing just fine. I wonder why PZ has such issues? Hmmm let's guess.
  Take a look at the quality of the comment section. While you are at it count how many times that dysfunctional Caine insults or belittles someone. (and they call me angry?)
 Just because I expect PZ to act like a dickhead and lie doesn't mean he gets away without me saying anything about it.  He claims he doesn't care but that is just because he is too stupid to realize the amount of truthful accounts/opinions showing him  for the dick he is, grows everyday. I'm doing my part to help. Pretty soon he is going to be known for what harm he has done rather than for anything he has done to help. It's a good thing he doesn't value what anyone thinks of him but if he doesn't care about others or the damage he has done why does he even bother in the first place? Doesn't he know the truth always wins?  

A Public Response To Paul Zachary "PZ" Myers- Quit Lying

Artists rendering  of  PZ Myers if he doesn't stop lying

Defamation

From Wikipedia

Defamation—also called calumny, vilification, traducement, slander (for transitory statements), and libel (for written, broadcast, or otherwise published words)—is the communication of a statement that makes a claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may give an individual, business, product, group, government, religion, or nation a negative or inferior image. This can be also any disparaging statement made by one person about another, which is communicated or published, whether true or false. 

  

famacide

 

fa·ma·cide

[fey-muh-sahyd] 

noun, Law.

a person who destroys another's reputation; a defamer or slanderer.

The Latin phrase famosus libellus means a libelous writing.
example:



Mr PZ Myers
   I figured I would make things as plain and simple as possible-
   You don't have the right to trash my character because you don't agree with me. Writing posts about people breaking the law, mentioning my name at the same time, then blocking my ability to defend myself from your inferred guilt is unfair and childish to say the least. I don't know where you learned to disrespect people or when you came to the conclusion your intellect is above everyone else, it isn't. You seem to think I am some internet punk who won't stand up for himself and will allow you to just say whatever you want while I sit there and take it.That also is incorrect. I have, am, and will hold you responsible for every word you have posted on the internet.  My ridicule of you does not give you the right to libel me. If you want to criticize behaviors I have actually displayed then that is one thing but I will not allow you to make up lies about me. I have not lied about your behavior, I don't think it is unreasonable to ask you to be honest. This isn't a game and I'm not interested in being part of your fantasy where you are superior to every other human on the planet and can do/say anything you want to/about them. People don't exist solely to be judged by you. .
 You are guilty of ongoing, public libel. I noticed you mention the number of followers you have on certain social media sites. This indicates you are well aware of the damage you could be doing you just choose to behave in a reckless  manner showing no concern for others whatsoever. What is it you want us to believe? When you are held responsible for publicly voicing your opinion (see A+) you act as if your own opinion is worthless, deserves no consideration, and has no effect on others.  In other cases you expect people to give your opinion value and embrace the ideas it relays (see feminism & A+). If they fail to do so it doesn't mean they are just different, it means they are idiots or assholes. It means they are no longer worthy of consideration. You must be well aware that for whatever reason some people see you as a leader. Your behavior is imitated by some people because they think it makes them cool. You have readers that look to you as a source of accurate information, you must know that. How do you repay these people? You abuse that respect by misleading them. You also use that respect as a weapon against people you have contempt for. In some cases that contempt stems from people who were defending themselves from your unfair claims about who/what they represent. (see Coffey Loving Skeptic) In some cases it isn't a fair fight (see Justin Vacula) and you know it. That makes you a very weak man PZ. This is a fact which is becoming clear to more people  each day.
  I have over 5 years of ReapSowRadio podcast recordings PZ that I offer as evidence you are wrong about me. I also offer my prior blog posts. Add to that 115 individual interviews I have done for The Angry Atheist podcast that show I do not spend the majority of my time screaming "motherfucker" into the microphone like you have said in your blog posts. The fact you even make such a claim shows how uneducated you are about the people you like to publicly trash. You have no idea what the hell you are talking about. You purposely spread disinformation as a way of attacking innocent people. You attack them on your blog and deny them any way of defending themselves.The only thing they are guilty of is criticizing you. You could at least allow the people you have hit with your banhammer (also known as your 'shield from criticism') one rebuttal along with your claims against their position or character.  You instantly remove my reply to your accusations. What are you afraid of?  It is important you understand this PZ...I'm not talking about people lying about you. I am talking about people who disagree with what you think should be acceptable by society standards. Just because they don't agree it doesn't make them evil or out to get anyone, it means they disagree. Try to connect the dots on this.
 I'll wrap it up with this- You are not going to force me to behave in a manner which meets your approval. Just because you have appointed yourself Feminism Czar that means shit to me. I already know how to work for equality and how to show respect. I also know how to tell when someone has no respect for others and deserves none back. You have been seeing the result of that. You will continue to see/feel a push-back as will Ed Brayton, Stephanie Zvan, Ophelia Benson, Lousy Canuck, and Adam Lee along with anyone else who thinks they can make the rules for the rest of us.Quit confusing atheists with creationists you idiot can't you tell the difference by now? Damn.
 

PZ Myers The Judge, The Jury, The Jerk

 Let's take a look at the latest blog from PZ Myers. He is a scientist, biologist, skeptic, atheist, feminist, I am sure we will find some interesting information about biology, skepticism, or science. Those are interesting subjects, let's see what good old PZ is going to teach us today...

http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2013/01/17/not-cool-not-cool-at-all/

    Hey! That's not about skepticism! It looks like a post that could be accusing Reap Paden of identity theft.  PZ left an important element out though......the proof, facts, some kind of evidence besides made up bullshit. 

 I have dealt with some real idiots over the years I have been on the internet but seldom do you see this kind of bullshit. I've dealt with paranormal investigators, religious believers, frauds, psychics, and just plain internet bullies. It is rare to find someone of this ilk. It isn't enough PZ has accused me of being and asshole, racist, misogynist, sexist, fucking scumbag, coward now he has to elude to me being an identity thief. The way he words it he may as well have me convicted already. 

  PZ, I have news for you. You are ignorant and oblivious to the opinions many people have of you these days I guess and I hate to be the one to break it to ya but......A lot of people think you are a moronic twit. That means there are lots of people who could have done what you are giving me credit for. 

You have the nerve to talk about cowardice? How chicken shit and low is it to suggest I may have something to do with pretending to be you and your pleasant conversation with a car dealer without ONE SINGLE BIT of proof except the fact I don't like you. The reason I don't like you is because of the exact kind of shit you see above. You don't have a clue as to what skepticism is. You think it is your place to judge a person and then trash their character in a public forum. You have done it to me, to Justin Vacula, and to many others including the 500 members of the slymepit forum.  With this post you have made it clear to me you deserve no respect from me whatsoever.  I assure you I am no coward. I will stand up for myself and take accountability for the things I do. I did not do what you suggest I am guilty of and if I ever see you then I will be confronting you about the claims you have made about me. Meanwhile you tell people to harass you too your face? PZ if anyone so much as said "boo" to your face you would probably begin weeping uncontrollably and lose control of  your bodily fuctions much like you have your mental faculties   

Who is the coward writing about me while I am in the dungeon banned from defending myself. Even if I do manage to post my comment has the vowels removed. Yea PZ very impressive how you blindfold, tie and gag your victims before you start a fight with them. Real impressive intellect you have there.

Now Let's look at some of the follow-up comments from PZ

 

    PZ is wrong again. I do not have 13 aliases although I soon might because the only way I can comment on his blog posts and lies is to create a new email addy. I also do not have 25 messages in the spam trap. PZ is obviously giving me credit for posts which are not mine or he is lying, again.

I am left wondering....Why bring my name into this at all? Why couldn't PZ just have wrote about some anonymous jerk that is ruining lives by making car dealers call him and have a pleasant conversation? Because he is pissed. Why is he pissed? Because I am right and because he feels foolish, as well he should.
PZ has slipped another rung or two with this unfair post. I have a reputation for being outspoken and honest. Something PZ doesn't know because he is convinced I am limited to screaming "motherfucker" as my only means of communication.
  I may not have the following PZ has but the people I have dealt with don't paint the kind of picture PZ is showing in his gallery.  People may not agree with the manner I use to deal with him but they can not say I am dishonest.
 I'll close with this. This time it is me being dragged through a mud-puddle PZ Myers made in his yard. I am no one special. I just think people should be treated with a certain level of respect and skeptics should be skeptical. I have been guilty of standing up for what I think is unfair or wrong. This time it was me, before me there were others, after me there will be more unless people speak up. Next time it could be you or anyone for that matter. All you need to do is speak out against the wrong atheist/skeptic or use the wrong word and it will be your turn. Is this how we build a better community and work toward positive progress? I don't think so, I would hope you agree.  

Step Right Up

 

Step Right Up

  Adam Lee @daylightatheism on twitter is the latest A+ idiot to accuse me of being a misogynist.Want to know why? Because I called Stephanie Zvan a bitch. Yes I did and I will continue to do so until she either stops being a bitch or I start to forget to do so.
 Adam Lee seems to think he can tell me how to express myself, to the point where he will decide what words I will use.  I have a very disappointing fact to share with Adam Lee.  That's not gonna happen in a million fucking years. There is nothing Adam can do that will stop me from saying whatever I choose in any way I choose as often as I choose wherever the fuck I choose.
 I already went through this crap with that moronic PZ Myers over Stephanie Zvan now this twit suddenly figures he has nothing better to do than create a personality for me that gives him an enemy to fight. It also provides him with a counter argument to Al Stefanelli while debating the feminism issue. The only reason I make for a good example is because Adam made up the specifics to suit his needs. After reading Adam's facebook  page it looks like to me he wants to become famous. His about me is a collection of things he thinks make him look important or cool. It has always been my belief such a display is a result of low self esteem. Here is some of the exchange I had with Adam. Keep in mind originally he had a problem with my use of the word "bitch" then moved on to accuse me of approving of sex tapes made about women I don't like......

And then we have Adam and Al Stefanelli on twitter. Adam is clearly being an idiot. He sounds like a small child telling his mother about something a sibling has done wrong in order to get some attention.

Porn? Only To Adam Lee

The "sex tape" Adam is referring to is a gif of a dog trying to have sex with a cow as you can see here. I don't consider this porn and I never actually thought that cow was Stephanie Zvan or the dog Greg Laden. Obviously Adam Lee does think Stephanie Zvan is a cow. He is convinced I have proved myself a misogynist because I think it is funny to joke about making sex tapes of women I don't like. For the record I would joke about a man or a woman making sex tapes whether I liked them or not. I'm fair that way. But this isn't a sex tape it's a gif file of a dog attempting to gratify itself on a disinterested cow. I don't want to know what Adam Lee's collection of porn in his home looks like if this is an example of a sex tape to him.  

  Since Adam seemed so intent on dictating what terms I am allowed to use I figured I would take a look at his website and see exactly where this guy was coming from. The second post I read says this-

 Anyone who knows me, either in real life or through e-mail correspondence, should be well aware that I am a steadfast defender of freedom of speech. I consider it to be the most important right any democratic society can have; it is, in a sense, the right upon which all other rights depend. That is why I support only the minimum necessary restrictions on it, such as laws which ban harassment or incitation to criminal activity, and oppose all other restrictions on speech, however well-intentioned.  http://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/02/comment-policy.htmlhttp://www.daylightatheism.org/2006/02/comment-policy.html

 

Really Adam? After reading that I can only assume Adam is full of shit any way you look at it. His whole displeasure of me calling Stephanie Zvan a bitch is just an attempt to win an argument and to get some needed attention drawn to himself. It's the only explanation that makes sense considering the weakness of his position. Adam go back to high school. You could learn a thing or two about maturity from those kids and while you are at it join the debating team you could use some instruction in that skill also. You are pathetic and inept.

 

Stephanie- The Queen Bitch Dick

Since there has been so much outcry among the FTB and A+ idiots about my calling Stephanie Zvan a bitch I am going to recant that statement. From this point on I will refer to Stephanie Zvan as a dick. Not dick as in penis, dick as in a huge jerk, a person who is unintelligent and annoying and treats other in a manner which is rude and/or condescending. In order to support my opinion I will offer the following statements from Stephanie Zvan..I mean dick

"Let’s put an end to this right now. It’s nice and all that you personally might think I’m handling this harassment well. Don’t ever fucking use me as your “proof” that someone else is doing it wrong."



"You are using me to make other harassed people feel and look worse. I did not ask for this. I will not stand for it. I would much rather adopt “bad” behavior myself than allow you to get away with that. I would rather stand in solidarity with them than judgment with you. Don’t make me do that.
Knock that shit off now."



"Don’t like the “personal” posts, the arguments between atheists? Go read something inspirational instead.
Consider yourself warned.
Justin, it’s time to knock this shit the fuck off.

I don’t care what you think about your opponent in an argument.

I don’t care what you think of Greg’s behavior, toward you or anyone else. You do not call harassment “an argument”. This is not argument."


 "Seriously, stop. You don’t have to like Greg. You don’t even have to acknowledge that you were begging for his forgiveness after you received the email you later called a threat. Just stop propping up people who are doing worse than he did to you because they’re doing it to him."

Regarding Justin Vacula and the SCA. Stephanie petitioned for Justin's removal. This is what first caused me to see Stephanie as a bitch (now upgraded to dick) Stephanie doesn't even live in PA and she has never met Justin. She acted on emotion and the need to bully pure and simple.
Stephanie writes-

 1. He has engaged in extreme behavior, including harassment, in opposing feminists within the secular movement which does not befit a leader and does not promote broad participation in the movement.


 2. He has, at the same time, minimized harassment as a problem within the movement and broader community.


 We believe it is inappropriate for such a representative to have unapologetically published on the site A Voice for Men, which describes itself: "AVfM regards feminists, manginas, white knights and other agents of misandry as a social malignancy. We do not consider them well intentioned or honest agents for their purported goals and extend to them no more courtesy or consideration than we would clansmen, skinheads, neo Nazis or other purveyors of hate." We further consider it inappropriate for Vacula to have used this site, monitored by the Southern Poverty Law Center, as a platform for attacking a fellow, feminist secularist.


 Not only has Vacula dismissed the harassment as unimportant, he has participated in it himself. He has participated very actively in the #FTBullies and #atheismplus campaigns, where anti-harassment and inclusion efforts are characterized as censorship, totalitarianism, dogmatism, group-think, and bullying (among the more polite terms). He has written blog posts on these topics that he promoted using those campaigns.


 He has been a regular commenter at what is now known as The Slyme Pit, a group dedicated to hatred of Rebecca Watson and anyone who is or is perceived to ally with her on matters of "radical" feminism. This group has produced threats requiring the attention of organizers of two different conferences and has been home to the cyberstalking Vacula defended as perfectly fine for "public figures". Vacula has participated in this group both before and after it was removed from National Geographic's ScienceBlogs website for violating nearly every provision of the site's code of conduct.


 In another, he reacted to the news that the #atheismplus campaign had triggered the chronic depression of Jennifer McCreight, causing her to stop her public activism. Jen is a blogger, speaker, and vice chair of the Secular Student Alliance board. Rather than noting that harassment that leads to results like this is bad for the movement he is trying to lead, he tweeted, "So, Jen’s allegedly finished blogging…and this time it’s not her boyfriend who kicked her off the internet." He did so using the #atheismplus tag, copying his contempt to the group that had been harassing McCreight.
Source-http://www.change.org/petitions/secular-coalition-for-america-remove-justin-vacula-from-a-leadership-position-in-the-pa-chapter-of-sca

She trashes Justin because he doesn't support feminism. One of Justin's blogs was posted on a men's rights website that isn't okay with Stephanie, I assume because she doesn't think men have rights. Stephanie also condemns Justin because he is a member of the Slymepit forum. She describes the forum as dedicated to hating Rebecca Watson which is a complete lie. She also claims the forum is responsible for threats. Stephanie couldn't prove any of this if her life depended on it. It is all bullshit. She then goes on to complain because Justin wasn't sad when Jen McCreight removed herself from blogging. News Flash- A collective sigh of relief went up when Jen said she was not going to blog anymore. Stephanie Zvan's  entire case against Justin Vacula was made up of honest mistakes by Justin, lies, emotion, and protecting her friends no matter what role they played in events. I know the mistakes made by Justin were not of malicious intent because I know Justin and I told him he needed to be more careful to not allow those things to happen again. Justin agreed and said those were not mistakes he would make in the future. Justin Vacula is an activist on line and in real life he is articulate and able to have a reasonable discussion without name calling and personal attacks. Many people see any criticism as a personal attack. Stephanie Zvan is one of those people. She is so stuck up she can't even see her own bias. She was just being vindictive towards Justin and that make her a bitch. Period.(at that time) In my opinion Stephanie is a bitch (now a dick) Anyone who wants to try and tell me I can't say so can suck it. This includes...

 

Ed Brayton the FTB owner and King Idiot

      You may be wondering why you haven't heard Ed's name from me before. That is because Ed really hasn't had much to do with the skepchick crap, PZ and his insane antics, or any of the other moronic loons telling lies and being self-righteous jerks on his little network. He owns Freethought blogs but I never held him responsible for what others were writing. He didn't seem to be very intelligent to allow something he had created be turned into a laughingstock but that was his business.

  It turns out that loudmouth Ed Brayton has fallen into and under control of PZ Myers. Ed yesterday publicly accused me of being sexist and claimed I called Stephanie Zvan a bitch (I did ) and a cunt ( I did not) He then went on to judge Al Sefanelli based on my alleged  behavior. I don't know why people like Ed Brayton insist on making others responsible for my actions but they really need to learn how the world works. Another lesson Ed and his merry band of morons would be better off knowing is how not to be a hypocrite. Over and over Freethought bloggers and A+ idiots have been crying and complaining about behavior they disapprove of when it is painfully easy to find public displays of them doing the same fucking things if not worse. PZ calling a volunteer up on stage only to treat her like a creepy drunk old man in a strip bar. "Hey honey if you wanna have some sex with me I ain't gonna stop ya" That is the same kinda shit PZ pulled on a stage, with an unsuspecting victim he hand picked. Or  complaining about Justin Vacula putting Surly Amy's address on the net (an accident) and then excusing Greg Laden for doing the same on purpose just because he was that hard up to try and get a win against superior wit. Let's not forget Surly Amy posting the link to Justin's posting on the net only making what she thought was bad, worse.  I hate to see what would happen if someone posted naked pics of Surly Amy on the net she would be posting the link all over the place and saying " Look at these naked pics of me. Some jerk has been posting them all over the net. Make sure you share this link so people know what a jerk that guy is. He is trying to allow everyone to see me naked OMFG!"

 It's this same story over and over. Canuck, acting like he knows anything about social interaction when it's obvious he is not capable of getting his thoughts across using the spoken word. At parties he must hand out a paper introducing himself so he doesn't get it all screwed up. When he tries to be part of a conversation he has to run to the printer and get a copy of his blogged reply when asked a question. Even then you can understand what the fuck he is trying to say only about 10% of the time.

  And that dick Stephanie Zvan bragging about being called a bitch and unfairly judging people. Stephanie is so oblivious to other people's perceptions of her it almost brings a tear to my eye. She writes about how no one is a challenge to her  superior intellect while she gets hers ass handed to her in the world outside of FTB. Stephanie just doesn't step out of the golden bubble she lives in, if she did she would be as embarrassed as we have been for her all this time. If ignorance is bliss Stephanie Zvan is multi-orgasmic, lucky her.

  I will give Ed credit for one point. Like I mentioned earlier I shouldn't have called Stephanie Zvan a bitch so now I consider her a dick. As it turns out Ed Brayton is the bitch in this sad display of rampant stupidity. I had made it a point up until now to mention that not all FTB bloggers were a part of this gang of idiots and I still believe  most are not falling into the abyss of hypocrisy and denial but Ed has made it clear what the position of FTB is so those people who disagree with his libelous declarations and his defending all the behavior that has caused such a deep divide among skeptics and atheists may want to find a new home for their blogs unless they don't mind being directly associated with the owner and his opinions.  Ed has made it clear he is not neutral in this, he sides with liars and narcissists, lunatics, and whiners. 

 If Ed thinks anyone on the side of truth and reason is going to give up and allow his gang of disinformation warriors run around unchecked he has been smoking too much weed. That is not going to happen. I will however take my gloves off. If he didn't like me before he knew me then he really isn't gonna like me as he gets to know me now that he has been talking shit about me in public. Ed you don't like me? I don't give a shit

PZ and his Dungeon

 PZ Myers added me to his 'dungeon' today. I knew it was bound to happen because I won't sit around and watch as him and his pitchfork brigade run rampant. I think it's bullshit and very pathetic on PZ's part the way he has been treating people who could have been his allies. He is passing judgement on people that he doesn't even know, won't listen to, can't understand, or just can't be bothered with.
  I realize it's his blog and he can do what he wishes with it but what he does with it and how he deals with comments still speaks as to his motives and/or ability to be reasonable and mature.

 One guy who goes by the name brownian (Ian Brown) is a regular on PZ's blog. Ian has said that he is known as an 'internet smartass'. I  don't know who told him he had anything to do with the word smart but Ian does not bring the word to mind in any form. Ian's contribution to skeptical thinking  is, as far as I can tell, making lame negative comments on comments other people have made on PZ's blog and generally being a moron. Ian isn't the usual moron he is one of those morons who thinks he is intelligent. It's not clear why Ian thinks this maybe his mother told him so because the kids at school made fun at him for eating paste or maybe it's just what happens when someone is too stupid to realize they are a dummy.

 Ian had claimed that there are no jobs a woman could be better suited for than a man and vice versa.  He had not done so in a mature, polite or reasonable way. He did not support his position, he just blurted it out while calling another commenter an idiot. The woman who made the original comment was not an idiot. Ian was just exercising his ability to lower a person's IQ simply by allowing them to read the result of his keystrokes.
  I had dealt with Ian before on the blog of my good friend and supporter Ophelia Benson. He was spouting off about me being an idiot because I was astonished he had actually said something smart. (it was a fluke)
 I had also listened to Ian in a google hangout with Rebecca Watson and PZ Myers along with some other people who were all telling the public how great atheism plus was. ( as it turns out...it's not great)
 In the google hangout you can see Ian can't manage to comb his hair much less contribute anything useful unless the story of a blog groupie is what you consider interesting.What is interesting is that Ian Brown has actually given some thought as to the value of his input on PZ's blog ( that would be equal to 0) Ian also shares the heartwarming story of how A+ saved him from leaving atheism/skepticism (lucky us...)
 Ian has his head shoved up PZ Myer's ass so far you can see the top of his head whenever PZ opens his mouth. When I informed Ian he had the same amount of wit found in a dead tree stump that was the part PZ means when he says "complaining about the commenters". Yes I was complaining brownian was being a stupid dick and his dickness was stemming from an incorrect claim.
  One interesting thing about the Pharyngula blog is the way its owner has taken a stand and often refuses to consider any opposing opinion. The other thing which I have mentioned before is the way PZ uses his blog to trash the reputations of others when he doesn't know the facts. He has done this on numerous occasions and he appears to simply not give a shit about what damage he could be doing to that person. Even if it has a minimal negative effect it is wrong because PZ has no right whatsoever to tarnish anyone's reputation because he believes gossip is truth.
 PZ Myers thinks he is above showing any consideration for people he doesn't like. It sounds like an ego thing. PZ also says he is an atheist, since that is true then why does he describe the control of his blog in these terms...
"There is only one guy in charge. I, PZ Myers, am the absolute despot in charge of the comments section. I can shut you out, I can delete your comments, I can disemvowel them if I please. Get it out of your head that I am a benevolent dictator; the only thing saving your ass is that I’m an incredibly lazy dictator. Your best strategy for continuing your posting privileges is to avoid rousing my attention.

Do not cross me on matters of site management. Do not argue with me. Do not tell me who to ban or who not to ban. I am cruel and pitiless. I will laugh at your feeble protestations. If you have a concern that I have abused my power, send me a personal email for consideration of your complaint. I will think about it."


 Does anyone else see the way PZ portrays himself as a sort of 'god of the bible' type? Speaking of god, someone posted a link to a blog by a Christian about PZ. It turns out that people on all sides are taking notice of his antics. It's a toss up who is being more of a jackass, commenters like brownian or PZ himself.
 PZ Myers is no longer someone atheists/skeptics can look towards as someone who can be respected, he has become an embarrassment. He is a public figure who truly makes atheists and skeptics look like idiots who can't apply reason anymore than fundamentalists. Usually when someone tries to compare outspoken atheists to fundamental preachers I will make this point- One side is dealing with reality. In the case of PZ Myers and the idiotic loons who are following his unreasonable lead, they are peddling fantastic beliefs that are rarely accurate. Not only that they are making it look like a large number of atheists/skeptics are potential rapists, sexist, racist, misogynists, or gender-traitors.
  I encourage people to go to PZ Myers blog and voice your concerns over his behavior. Let's fill the dungeon with reasonable people and protest improper behavior. If you think I am telling lies because I am simply pissed off about being put in the dungeon then read some of the other accounts being posted about the same things I am talking about here. We need to do something about this behavior it has gone on long enough. The damage PZ and his horde of inept locus have done can't be undone easily if ever but we can work to stop it from going any further. It's almost as if we have been set up by PZ. He is one of the people who can do major damage to progress that has been achieved, he has done damage already.
 Brownian if you read this-Quit behaving in ways that will make you ashamed later should you ever come to your senses. You are a sad man who contributes nothing and knows it. You have already convinced many people you are socially retarded even if you don't realize it. Go start your own blog instead and let us all know how well it goes I'd love to see it. If you ever muster up the courage I'd be happy to have a person to person discussion with you about any of the subjects we have disagreed on it would be my pleasure.

Here are links to posts by others supporting what you have read here I encourage you to look into this yourself don't take my word for it, after all, I'm just a rambling asshole.Right PZ?

 Welcome_to_the_Phawrongula_Wiki



 Rebecca Watson Lies Again & PZ Swallows It Whole



 Atheist Opposition to PZ Myers



 Rebecca Watson (The Skepchick): a liar?



 A+ part 2: Pontiff Myers and the Chalice of Poisonous Drivel



 Justin Vacula's Blog 

  If you need more just google "pz myers is a dick" you don't just get crying and whining you get real accounts of PZ Myers being a prick and acting like a schoolyard bully. His actions are dangerous and harmful. PZ if you read this please- Shut the fuck up already.You've undermined everything you ever achieved as it is.

 

Speaking of Shunning

   


    In a blog on the CFI website Ronald Lindsay presents some good news. The Center for Inquiry is not going to be shunning speakers just because a bunch of people have threatened a boycott  if a certain person is speaking. I think that makes perfect sense. I also think, as I have said before- We should not refuse associate with people just because they don't think exactly like us.
  For the CFI or any other organizer to give in to threats of a boycott based on a difference of opinion would be a bad thing and would soon result in a big damn mess every time there was a conference.

    While we should all realize there is one boat  we are all traveling in together, some don't see it like that. They want to claim the boat is theirs and they can choose who is the dead weight. That isn't the way it works, and those people should be waking up to that fact by now. These people think they are the be-all-end-all when it comes to social values, skeptics, and atheists. They think the people who rally around them nodding and smiling represent the people of the world. That is an incorrect assumption. I'm afraid the reality is --1)Most people don't care about you or 2)don't know who the hell you are, and if they did it wouldn't change fact #1. Add to this the very important fact that most people are moderates, they don't want to deal with your extreme views no matter what they are about.

 

 While I think we should include everyone who has something new, interesting and worthwhile to say, I also wonder if some of the people who are most often invited to speak really meet that criteria. PZ Myers gave his talk about atheism having a soul and A+ thinking and it was a snore-fest  I don't think even he was awake during the entire talk. In the video you can see the attendees start looking around for a piece of rope to make a noose.  Since then PZ Myers himself has given everyone fair warning that he probably won't have anything new to say until.....well I doubt he will manage to ever work that out considering the direction his feeble mind is headed. Why then is he even being invited to attend as a speaker? Is there a shortage of people who can speak to large groups about a topic atheists/skeptics find interesting? Or how about Rebecca Watson?....When is the last time she said something that hasn't been heard a thousand times before, or even something true? The only way she can manage to say anything people  haven't grown tired of is to either lie or twist the meaning in order to make it seem like important new information or unbelievable drama.
     Rebecca Watson can't shut up long enough to realize she doesn't speak for every woman on the planet. She should also realize you can't force people to agree with you just by acting like they don't matter when they disagree. The same kind of thing can be said about people like Ophelia Benson who seems to be blogging as if someone has a gun pointed at her head and is forcing her to blog something, anything no matter how petty, unimportant, or ignorant.  Here is some advice--If you don't have anything to say then shut up. Maybe spend more time reading and listening to the opinions of other humans who have put just as much thought into things as you, if not more.  Who is interested in paying money and/or wasting time to hear Ophelia tell them things like how she doesn't like the word "cunt" or how bothersome it is that people use the short version of  someone's name?

     Would it be entertaining to listen as Stephanie Zvan gave new definitions to all the words in the English language? That seems to be her major focus at this time, when she isn't accusing people of hating all women because they don't like her friends. Or maybe it would be better to spend the $250 or whatever it is Richard Carrier is asking on some old propaganda films from WW2 or the cold war. You could get the same feeling and still have money left over to serve everyone hot dogs and a shot of whiskey. Better yet you could ask someone who isn't actively calling for a war between atheist/skeptical factions that only exist as your self fulfilling prophecy.
    Yes we include people who think outside of the box or who may stir things up a little, but just as you can have a mind that is too open, you can have a policy that invites thinking that will be more harmful than helpful or interesting.
    The bottom line is some people are just looney and/or attendees are gonna get bored listening to the same old common sense delivered with the enthusiasm it deserves for being repeated for the 7,995,547th time. No one is going to need to worry about who is speaking because no one will be there to listen. I'm sure some conference organizers know this already and will manage to offer the opportunity for some new face to enlighten the masses. Wouldn't it be nice to listen to someone who has a new or even just a different delivery of the topics we  find of interest or importance?
     I may be a bit biased but the SkeptiCal conferences we have in my area are very good at providing new and interesting speakers each year. I'm sure there are other similar events, in my opinion they should all be this way. Ronald is correct about shunning others but you shouldn't keep having the same things repeated to you over and over by the same people, or make it a habit of helping spread thinking that undermines the very thing you are working to achieve, unless you are expecting a different result, but that is an entirely different issue isn't it?
 Here is Ronald's post. Make sure you check out the comments for a laugh or two...or a cry

Ronald A. Lindsay-On Shunning Fellow Atheists and Skeptics

Stephanie Zvan and Friends-STFU

 The following is not a meltdown (give me a break) and I use foul language (break number two please) So if you are offended by such language you should just move on to other things. My grammar may also suck. This means if you are an English teacher you may break out into hives or something while reading, otherwise I will assume you can figure it out. I hope I didn't overestimate anyone. Funny I usually don't have to make these points........

   First, I'm not going anywhere. Second, if any single one of the morons who have been talking shit and pretending like they know who or what I am would like to own up to their assumptions and have real conversation with me then I am more than willing to do just that. If Jason The Lousy Canuck wants to talk shit let him do it straight to me. If Stephanie Zvan can't understand how she is being childish and why I think she is being a bitch then I am happy to tell her so personally. If any one of the judgmental groupies on the blogs Stephanie (or anyone else) has spent time writing about me has anything to say they too are invited to say it straight to me. The keyboard warrior bit may awe some of the more easily impressed people out there but I'm not one of those people. I guess I could sum it up as follows- Step up or shut up.

 Stephanie Zvan, you simplistic moron, I can't explain it to you in a more simple fashion than I already have.
  I'm not about too be bullied and I'm not going to cower to anyone. You would save time and effort to accept the fact that you can not win. I can't stress this point enough.  The petition you started against Justin Vacula was based on incorrect assumptions. You refused to even consider for one minute that maybe you were biased or maybe some of the shit you had been hearing was not quite true.
    Or maybe you fell for some of Jason's  rhetoric. It's a fact The Lousy Canuck has a lot of trouble telling the damn truth.  How pathetic it is to need to make up crap and build up drama in order to make a point anyone will give a shit about? I guess Canuck can't find any real topics that he can present factually and make interesting, too bad for him. I counted the fallacies in one of his blog posts and it was just sad. It is a stretch calling him skeptical or even level-headed. He was all emotional and weepy because he thought people were attacking  Surly Amy when no one was attacking her, it was her ideas that were the problem. It would be nice if he would take aim at some inanimate objects instead of trashing real people with his lies and high school drama.
  Even if Justin Vacula was talking shit it doesn't make him a woman hater it means he is having an argument with a person who happens to be a woman. How can anyone not know the difference? Justin has plenty of support from women who know him in real life. Did you ever stop to consider their opinions? Nope. Cause you know it all already. I have news for you and several others- You don't know everything about everyone, it's impossible for you to know especially if you only know what a person has posted on the net. It's the internet. I'm not sure if you are stupid or you are just pretending to be completely uninformed about behavior on the internet. A large percentage of people on the internet say things they would never say to a person face to face and they threaten to do things they would never have the testicular fortitude to pull off in real life. That is the way it is and it is a well established fact. Try reading more.
     I happen to think Stephanie is a huge bitch while on the internet, why she feels the need to be a bitch I do not know. In real life I would assume she is functional and probably doesn't speak to people in the same manner as she does on the net. Maybe I'm wrong and she is a bitch in real life too. I don't imagine many people would like her or want to be around her but at least she would be consistent. See? Notice the way I admit I don't know for sure? Even if I do make assumptions I like to fall on the positive side because there must be some good qualities about Stephanie she is just hiding them while she is on the net ......maybe.
    Same goes for Jason except I would think he is probably one of those people who annoys others when speaking to them because he can't translate his ideas into words very well. Otherwise he probably means well. Or he could be a bitter, socially inept wuss who can only get the revenge he seeks on those who have wronged him by lashing out and telling lies about whoever comes along. There really is no way to know for sure because I am not psychic and, unlike Stephanie, I don't  make assumptions and present them as facts.
     What this all comes down to is a bunch of people who think they know more about the world than anyone else wanting to force their thinking on others and I'm here to tell those people to FUCK OFF. You aren't going to force your methods or reasoning on me. I'm smart enough to know what is right and wrong and what is in between. I am also smart enough to know that everyone should be included in dialogue. People who are ignorant or behave in ways that are harmful to others will usually learn by example because people want to fit in. They will have to follow certain rules of behavior in order to be active participants or people will NATURALLY move away from those behaviors or they will be told to stop being a dick. You don't dismiss people completely because they don't think like you.
    No one needs a bunch of people stuck in a high school mentality to label them based on what is said in a comment section on the internet. Anyone who thinks what is said in a comment section on the internet is a good way to accurately gauge a persons overall personality is just plain dumb.
   While I am at it I'd like to address one more person who is acting like a jackass, PZ Myers. PZ I know you really have no interest in listening to anyone who dares to question you but if I could have one minute.
 I had you on my radio show a couple years back and found you to be informative and entertaining. You were a good guest. I went to see you speak at UC Berkley and you did a great job of presenting yourself. What happened? You've turned into an embarrassment. I don't know if you lack any friends to tell you or maybe you just won't listen to them either but I'll tell you something- You need to check yourself.
    Trying to make people look foolish just because you can does not do anyone any good. You have done this on more than one occasion and you should be above such things. To take a readership that you built by being reasonable and turn it into a vehicle to recklessly trash others who are on your side based on information you have no way of knowing is true is incredibly irresponsible. I don't know who the fuck you think you are or what the fuck your motivation is but the damage you have done to the reputations of other people can't be completely fixed even if you wanted. You don't have the right to make other people look bad or to ruin their credibility.  It is a shame to see happen. All you need to do is stop being a dick to people who have common interests. Is that too difficult? Next time you appear at a conference why not just read of a list of atheists you think are dicks and the reasons why?
You do it in parts on your blog, what's the difference? I know the points I make will probably fly right over whatever it is you are using for a head these days but at least I can say I tried

  So to recap....Anyone who has dreams of "cleaning up" the internet can wake the hell up cause no one needs your services forced upon them. Stephanie, your 'effectiveness' is limited to say the least. Luckily you have your childishness to fall back on. Babble all you like and I will keep on presenting my opinions. I'm a part of 4 different podcasts, I write a blog,  I am on many social media sites, and I do guest spots on shows every so often. No one or thing is going to stop me.I have been doing this for years, people who know me know what to expect from me and now you know too don't you Stephanie Zvan?  Now what?

 Oh and Stephanie could you please stop sending emails to my friends about issues you have with me? It is very annoying and kinda creepy. Thanks in advance

PZ Myers-The Leader Who Isn't

 

To clear up a mistaken assumption I  heard this week. I do not act on behalf of any group or other individuals. I act on behalf of myself. I belong to many many forums and have contact with many groups. None of my actions/words/opinions are officially shared by anyone else unless I specifically state as much or they choose to publicly say so themselves.  This also works the other direction. Others do not speak for me unless I say so. 

Definition of LEADER: a person who has commanding authority or influence 

 PZ Myers says..

 "There was so much projection going on I was wondering how such low-wattage bulbs could be pretentious enough to think they could cast light on anything.

But let me show you a few examples to illustrate what I mean. These are all quotes from people who were yammering at me; pseudonyms have been removed to protect the stupid."
---

 pretentious
 a : making usually unjustified or excessive claims (as of value or standing)   b : expressive of affected, unwarranted, or exaggerated importance, worth, or stature-  For example- PZ Myers referred to those who disagreed with him  as yammering, stupid people, which came off as a bit pretentious.

PZ says
"They cannot comprehend an organization without a dictator, therefore atheism+ has a secret dictator somewhere. They cannot understand how an idea could be advanced without being treated as dogma, therefore atheism+ is dogma." 
He continues..
" I have a surprise for them: I’m not a member of the Atheism+ forum. I am not a leader of this movement; I have no position in it at all. I like the idea and I’m happy to encourage people to explore it, and I’ve long been pushing ideas similar to what has coalesced as the atheism+ movement, but I’m not even remotely “in charge”. And that’s the way I like it."
-----

   Couple of problems here...PZ is a smart fella you want to tell me he can't figure out why people would consider him a leader of the A+ kateers? Even IF he wasn't a leader (he is) there must be enough common sense left in his head to figure out why people would assume he is.
    PZ doesn't realize that people read his blog I guess. He doesn't realize that the reason groups ask him to speak isn't because they want to hear from someone no one listens to. I watched a video of a (boring) talk PZ gave at the Ascent of Atheism convention titled "The Soul of the New Atheism"
I'm not going to question the time put into figuring out a good title. I think that putting the words soul and atheism in the title is going to put people off from the start, but what do I know? I'm no biologist. I must be one of those yammering stupid people PZ is talking about...hmm.

      PZ stands at a podium and talks about A+ for about 45 minutes minus some video footage that people could have watched on you tube instead of in the company of PZ and been perfectly happy. PZ mentions Dawkins several times and tries to convince us that science is the same as social issues. Um.....yea you can not treat social issues the same as you can evolutionary science.There are very few constants.
  Now we have a new scientist telling us about a new, new wave of atheism. PZ Myers, who has almost nothing to do with A+ except he leads google hangouts talking about the subject. He has blogged about it numerous times. He has defended it even as it cost him the respect of many he had earned while talking about things he actually had knowledge of. PZ been unfairly labeling people, publicly attacking people, belittling, and even lying about those who are not in agreement with him. He has been very vocal in his support of A+kateer...he is no leader of it though.
 At the end of the talk PZ takes questions from the crowd. It seems that PZ either has the answers or he knows where to get them. More leadership qualities....
  PZ quit insulting our intelligence, you are to A+ what Tom Cruise is to Scientology, it's most well known member/supporter. That makes you a leader unless you want to shut up about it and let the people you call leaders run the damn show. Just because you aren't part of the A+ forum doesn't disconnect you from every other aspect, you are connected. If you are going to be going around giving talks about A+ at conventions shouldn't you become a member of the A+ forums so you can provide correct and current information to those people who usually paid to listen to you speak?



 PZ says-
"I am deeply amused by the idiot who thought he could point out the hypocrisy of a movement that values diversity by announcing that two privileged old white men are in charge. We’re not. He could only make that claim by ignoring the fact that the person who triggered the whole process and has put in a lot of organizational effort was a privileged young white woman, Jen McCreight, and the person who has been promoting it most wonderfully is a privileged middle-aged white bisexual woman, Greta Christina.
----

   So because someone calls attention to the two loudest voices involved with A+ he is an idiot? PZ I don't know when you became so dense but it isn't difficult to see how someone would equate Richard Carrier's manifesto and you dressed in a suit with a huge A+ on he front as indications you two were some sort of A+ leaders. From what I have heard and seen , Jen McCreight has been staying away from the internet  because  she isn't comfortable with some of the feedback about A+. She even spent time banned from the internet by her boyfriend. You were running (leading) the google hangout where Jen talked about staying away from the internet you know how she was feeling about it. As for Greta Christina, "promoting it most wonderfully" isn't how I would describe some of her behavior. For the record I had a great deal of respect for Greta, had her as a guest on my podcast, she was interesting and enjoyable to talk to. It bothers me a great deal to see how she has been acting towards her readers/commenters and the way she has been allowing certain commenters to run amok. PZ, go read the comments on the A+scribe blog.
 The comment section eventually  moves toward something more civil but the damage has been done. The people who caused the damage should have known better. It's not as if any of the players are new to the rodeo.
 Is that how A+ works? Is that an example of Greta correctly promoting it? There is a serious problem if that is the case.



PZ says
As I’ve explained, I’m not a member of atheism+ and am not engaged as a leader in any way. Similarly, Rebecca Watson has expressed interest and sympathy with its goals, but is not on the bandwagon. But apparently, we are two great villains, so the people who hate atheism+ imagine that it must be a reflection of our desires. How pathetic.
  -----

    At this point I am thinking that I do not need to make a case showing PZ has no social skills, he is doing that himself. Several times now he has mocked other people as idiots when it is he himself who can't connect the damn dots. PZ Myers needs to take a step back, quit screaming "IDIOT" at anyone who doesn't see things the way he does, and realize he isn't a master at social interaction. I'm not saying he has ever claimed to be but he is in way over his head trying to carry this A+ flag. He can't even begin to consider that  there may be valid reasons for the way people feel or the way they see the A+ movement. In case you didn't know it PZ your popularity has dropped so has the number of people who respect you. I know this is going to be hard for you to believe but the reason for this  isn't because a bunch of woman haters are pissed you won't let them abuse women. It's because you have lost touch with the middle of the road and you are treating atheists just like you would creationists. The two are not comparable. Creationists have beliefs based on false data and denial of facts. Atheists who disagree with PZ Myers about social issues, disagree with PZ Myers about social issues, that's it. They aren't stupid just because of that. Everyone has their own line as to what is acceptable and what is not when it comes to social behaviors. There are very few black/white issues when it comes to what are acceptable social behaviors.You seem to be unaware of that fact.




PZ continues...
Another theme that emerged is that, when I said there isn’t a person in charge of atheism+ telling you what to think, well then, it can’t work. Without an authority defining every last nuance, it’s going to fall into endless schism.

I’m pointing out that a label is meaningless if people have multiple interpretations of what it is.

How do you not understand that nobody deciding what Atheism+ is makes it meaningless?

If there’s no leadership/hierarchy, who decides what Atheism+ stands for?

Like, umm, the word “atheist”? There is a straightforward dictionary definition of that word, of course, but one thing you quickly discover if you actually interact with a lot of atheists is that the meaning in practice varies a lot. I have met atheists who believe in reincarnation; atheists who think Chopra is on to something with his ‘universal consciousness’ claims; atheists who are activists and atheists who just want to be left alone; angry anti-religion atheists and atheists who want to build a church of atheism; stupid atheists and smart atheists; philosophical atheists and pragmatic atheists. We’ve got Atheist Alliance and American Atheists and CFI and the American Humanist Association, all promoting atheism with subtle differences in emphasis.
Does that make atheism meaningless? Of course not. I’ve been telling people for years that there is a diverse world of atheism out there, with different causes and different consequences. And I’ve been against this contrary and irrational effort to pretend they’re all the same.
-----

  Okay..uuummm.....Who was ever saying all atheists are the same? I don't know a single person who would say that and I have never heard anyone claim that to be true.
  The disconnect you have here PZ is that there is ONE thing these people have in common, they don't believe in a god(s) And the word atheism has a definition. I looked up the definition of the plus sign.

plus sign

1. Mathematics The symbol (+), as in 2 + 2 = 4, that is used to indicate addition or a positive quantity.

2. Chemistry The same symbol, used to indicate dextrorotatory rotation of polarized light.

 The definition says it all. It is not specific. Most people want to know what term, names, and labels mean.There is nothing specific about a + sign, it is vague. You can say it represents important social values that are good for society....Who says what is important and what isn't? Says who? That's why it seems that A+ needs a leader, at least one who admits they are instead of telling us to ignore the man behind the curtain holding a bunch of yellow bricks.

 PZ says...

A+  states a general emphasis on social justice issues
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     What social justice issues? I have heard it is against people who are douchebags. That isn't a good description, it is open to interpretation to say the least. A social action is only as good as the way it accurately defines itself and acts true to that definition.
  Also, I am getting kinda confused. If PZ isn't a leader in the movement in any way. PZ isn't even a member of the A+ forum how does he know anything about what it is? How does he know the A+ movement hasn't changed into something completely different as people began to discuss it in a forum safe from anyone who doesn't agree? So if we were to be honest PZ is calling people stupid and putting them in their place for not knowing exactly what A+ is when he may be talking out of his ass for his entire post (wouldn't be the first time)


PZ says...

Atheism+ is a safe space for people to discuss how religion affects everyone and to apply skepticism and critical thinking to everything, including social issues like sexism, racism, GLBT issues, politics, poverty, and crime.

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     So suddenly we all came to an agreement on how to deal with all these social issues and we named it A+? No we didn't?
   Okay so we all want to discuss these issues and do it without anyone disagreeing and being a dick about it? That would be nice except we come back to one of my previous points. Everyone has their own line where reasonable becomes being a dick. Some people are more sensitive than others. Compassionate people are often mistaken as being angry by other because text doesn't provide the emotions a person is feeling. This is a very common problem and results in misunderstandings constantly especially among people who are unaware of how emotion and mannerisms can effect the way a persons words are interpreted.
   It is impossible to discuss complex social issues and not have disagreement and sometimes very emotional disagreement. There is a reason we must deal with social issues and it isn't because of religion alone. We also need to realize that logical and skeptical thinking isn't going to solve all those issues.


PZ says..

And the assholes creep out of the woodwork to find excuses to tell these people, indirectly, that applying critical thinking to social issues is bad. Oh, they can’t come right out and say that, of course, because that would make their stupidity obvious; so they invent bizarre excuses that it doesn’t have a pope, therefore it can’t work, or that it’s hypocritical because it made an old white man a cardinal, or that its a movement that is “divisive” — a favorite word in that crowd — as if their raging sexism and unconcern for broader social issues weren’t already divisive. 
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   I'm sick of PZ Myers accusing people of things like "raging sexism" when they disagree with him. Who has no concern for broader social issues? Is there an "Atheists Against Minorities" group I'm unaware of? No because that type of group would be dealt with if it should arise. Applying critical thinking isn't bad when you apply it to social issues as long as part of that critical thinking includes realizing critical thinking won't solve all the issues. Then what do you do? A+ doesn't seem to have an answer for that. There is little if any room for disagreement in the A+kateers club. It doesn't encourage debate or even discussion, at least not that I have seen yet. It includes accusing the person in disagreement of some broad hate even if they only disagree on some small point, then banning them and talking shit after they are gone. PZ has been a leader on this tactic also.

PZ says..
So, all you anti-atheist+ people, I challenge you: tell me what will happen to you if you don’t join atheism+? (Oh, and keep in mind that I haven’t ‘joined’ anything either; I’m more sympathetic than you are, but you won’t find my name on the atheism+ forum, yet.)
Here are the only answers that they came up with.

You don’t see it that way? The whole “Come to Atheism+ or we’ll leave you?” Carrier’s “Join us or we’ll never be friends?” Etc.?

Those evil atheist+ fanatics might unfriend you on facebook if you don’t join! Rarely has a tyranny had such awesome instruments of coercion. That’s really all we’ve got; we can decide you’re an asshole because you don’t share our values, and we can stop associating with you. Everyone does that. It’s not a special power, it is not the application of force.
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 Challenge accepted.....
   I have watched on thread after thread as people are banned for no good reason, accused of being what they are not, and linked to deeds they never were a part of. All of this is not good for anyone. It builds resentment and it makes comment sections hostile towards anyone with a differing point of view. It hurts our ability to work together towards a common goal. It does this by indicating atheists who don't have a + don't back the things A+ claims to support.
   I was publicly accused of trolling the A+scribe website simply because I signed into the site. Then I had a conflict with the person running the twitter account. Because I was pissed at being accused of something I hadn't done. I was described as "a man who has been politely rejected by a woman and then starts to yell at her" I didn't have any idea if it was a man or a woman I was dealing with and "politely rejected" suddenly describes when a person falsely accuses you of something?  I was told that my criticism of A+ made me evil.
    It isn't going to cause me to cry myself to sleep but I don't like being accused of being what I am not. Nobody has the right to lie about me or what  I am. I am not the only person to go through this type of shit. I am unfairly judged and labeled as something I am not because of A+.  If anyone is stupid in this whole thing one of those people would be PZ Myers. He is too stupid to realize what is going on because he is too busy being unquestionably correct about everything. If he wasn't stupid then he would have wrote about Richard Carrier and how that loon fits into the A+ equation or if he does at all.How he thinks halting interaction with people you don't agree with is productive and make you deserving of a + sign is beyond my understanding. Obviously PZ must have an idea of how many different people are defining A+ why are people stupid when they don't know who is right? After all there is no spokesperson, no central figure. And if A+ can be defined by each person as they choose why aren't more people involved up in arms about good old Dick's version?
   PZ himself has been guilty over and over again of calling people stupid and portraying them as foolish and silly  just because they have a differing opinion from his. PZ Myers doesn't seem to be able to understand just because someone disagrees with you it doesn't automatically make them stupid or wrong. Whether PZ likes it or not A+  gives the impression that it considers itself a better version of atheism, the attitude of the people who are wonderfully promoting it proves that to be the case. It can not make such a claim because it has not proven anything yet. Time will tell us if the + really makes a positive difference. So far it has caused more problems than it has solved.


PZ says..
You get the idea. I spent an hour arguing with really stupid people. But then, I’ve spent even more time arguing with creationists, so I’m used to it. 
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   And I have spent too much time addressing people who are behaving like children on the playground.Calling other kids names because they are different. Don't get me wrong I will call somebody an idiot when they deserve it but they don't deserve it because they are ignorant or just think different. Everyone is ignorant about something, even PZ Myers but I don't know if he would ever admit it. Some people who take every message they get as an immediate and direct threat have started a special club because they couldn't stand up and fight when something they believed in was being hijacked. Instead they ran away to hide where it was safe from people who don't make things as easy as possible and don't say nice things in a nice way.
     PZ you are a leader because people pay attention to your words. There was a time when I could understand why people did so. Now, not so much. You spend too much time acting as if the people who speak out against you are also acting against everyone else in the same manner. That isn't true. You are going to be one of the contacts people go to when they disagree with A+ because you act like you are a leader of some type. Why are you treating people like idiots by expecting them to believe you aren't? For you to expect anyone to believe you have nothing to do with A+ except you mention in passing because you like the idea, even calling anyone who suggests it names, makes you look like a lop.You are promoting this A+ thing and have made it part of your conference talks. Now you own part of it at least, accept it ....it is what Tom Cruise would do.

Here's the link to PZ's full  blog post 
I don't think anything was taken out of context but you may check for yourself